Transforming and Selling Businesses with Alexis Sikorsky, Part 2

This week, Dan picks up with Alexis Sikorsky—entrepreneur, investor, and founder of Knight Scale Partners—for the tactical follow-through: what great private equity actually brings, how to replace yourself post-acquisition (“please chairman me”), why agility beats prediction in a world of Black Swans/“Black Dragons,” and how agencies can still win as AI re-sorts the field. If you’re navigating uncertainty, planning pivots, or gearing up for an exit, this continuation is packed with clear plays and hard-won context.

Show Highlights

• What great PE actually brings: cost discipline, better people, and world-class sales—why the dream target has a weak or no sales team. [00:00:49]
• “Please chairman me”—why Alexis replaced himself as CEO and why being chairman can be the best job in the world. [00:02:07]
• Exit math that stuns: sold remaining shares for an undisclosed nine figures; two years later buyers resold for +60%, ~16× cash multiple. [00:02:36] [00:03:03]
• Retired, then Oxford: why he went back to school, started advising (even pro bono), and turned mistakes into a playbook. [00:03:52]
• Two superpowers: leadership (not management) and turning complexity into five actionable steps. [00:06:44]
• Triple headwind case study: clients dying, business model dying, channel dying—plus “Google is in panic.” [00:11:06]
• Pivot playbook: keep your domain (e.g., real estate), expand geographies, diversify inbound (podcasts/LinkedIn), and add warm outbound. [00:13:28] [00:14:41]
• AI won’t erase agencies—it will empower fewer winners (think 6,000 → 600); VCs shifting to AI-enabled efficiency. [00:15:28]
• Black Swans (“Black Dragons”): don’t time them—build agility and expect a crisis about every decade; a leveraged-forex cautionary tale. [00:17:36] [00:18:38]
• War-chest rule: keep ~9 months of burn so shocks don’t kill you. [00:20:14]
• Sci-fi as systems training: Asimov and a love letter to The Three-Body Problem (especially the brutal Book 3). [00:21:58] [00:23:33]
• Cashing Out: a simple method to go from small to less small—and how to speak private equity. [00:24:54]
• Where to find him: Knight Scale Partners (with a K), LinkedIn, and Instagram—unique name makes him easy to find. [00:26:56]

For more updates and my weekly newsletter, hop over to https://betterquestions.co/

To learn more about Alexis Sikorsky, check out the websites below: 

https://www.knightscalepartners.com/ 

https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexis-sikorsky-consulting/?originalSubdomain=uk

Transcript:

[00:00:00] Welcome back. Are you ready to hear the second part of the conversation with Alexis? Enjoy.

[00:00:05] Digging out of a hole feels very different than building something that's exciting.

[00:00:10] Was it both, was it one or the other? Like what,

[00:00:12] what do you attribute that growth to? 

[00:00:14] So a hundred percent B Yeah. Really a hundred percent. Because, and that's a big lesson learned for me, and that's part of what I always said. If I, if I started new access my software company, knowing what I know now, I would have sold 50 million more and five years earlier.

[00:00:36] Uh, what they know and you don't know is what they bring to the table. So they knew my, my business plan was optimistic, like even, uh, a dreamer plan. 

[00:00:49] Mm-hmm. 

[00:00:49] But all the info I didn't have, and they have is what they bring to the table. Like they come, they optimize everything for you. They cut your cost.

[00:00:58] They, they give you better people. They give you salespeople. They, so the dream company for private equity, it's a company that's grow, that sell and has a shitty or no sales team, because that's the biggest thing they bring to the table, right? We are evaluating, I, I, I very rarely, but from time to time live with private, uh, work for some private equity deal, and right now I'm paid for by a private equity to evaluate a company, and it's an absolute shitty company.

[00:01:28] They, they have like 15 years and no profitability. And it's a gold mine because they're still growing, uh, with no sales team, so that they know stuff you don't. So I did that. Um, and then with the help grow the company for, from a 15 ish million revenue to a 15 million revenue. And then we did that by acquiring [00:02:00] another company, and then I realized that the guy, the CEO of the company we acquired was so much better than I was.

[00:02:07] And I went to see the p and say, guys, like that's ridiculous. This guy must, must be the CEO. He's five years or 10 years older than me, has a way bigger international experience. Uh, please chairman me. And we hired this guy, CEOI got chairman. Best job in the world. Like instead of working 16 hours per day, you, you work half a day per month and you get the same salary because the private equity is so scared to fire you that they pay you the same salary for virtually doing nothing.

[00:02:36] And after that, I had like new, new, new wife, new life, new country and I, and I sold the rest of my shares to the private equity to um, undisclosed nine figures number. This is the official term 'cause I have an NDA. They, and the, the last, uh, episode is they sold the company two years ago for, um, 60% more than what they bought me at the end.

[00:03:03] So basically they bought for, they sold for 16 times the cash they put in the company, give or take. Wow. It's a fantastic success story for everyone. For everyone, everyone. And so that brings me to where I am now. So I retired 20 19, 20 10, 20 20. I completely re retired for three years, like literally traveling the world and doing nothing.

[00:03:28] I had enough money. And then three years ago, um. Few things happened, but one, it was, I starting to get a little bit bored and also my money was starting to running a little bit thin because all the great advice I give to my client, I don't often, uh, apply them myself, sort of said, okay, let's let get you as off the couch and go do something.

[00:03:52] So I went to Oxford and did an executive MBA. Ah. And while I was doing that, I met [00:04:00] tons of entrepreneurs, right? Mm. And I was like, ah, crap. These guys are doing exactly the same mistake that I've been doing. And that's why I say, okay, let's, let's help these guys. So I did a few, I do, I still do a few. I don't, don't, don't, don't tell that.

[00:04:17] But I do a few pro bono and, and then I go, got to bigger companies and, and getting paid a little better. And that's, that's why I am, so basically what I bring to the table is I made all the mistakes. You, you you made, and I have something that you don't necessarily have is I incredibly fantastically lucky my whole life when every bad decision I make and God knows, there've been tons of these, I've been compensated by something incredibly lucky.

[00:04:49] And do you, so this is a thing that I'm always interested in, right? Because some people will say, um, you know, you might be lucky, but you are also lucky because you put yourself in the position to be lucky. Right? The, the thing that jumped out to me about your story. Was the part where you saw the CEO of the other company.

[00:05:11] You were like, that guy should be CEO. Right? So you, you, it would be very easy to imagine you having a big enough ego that you were like, well, it's my thing and I'm the CEO, and sort of putting yourself in that position, even after you exited and you had all this success that I think many people would, you know, kill for, right?

[00:05:34] Then you went, you went back to school, right? So you have this tendency to, even though even when you're doing well, to put yourself back in the learner's position, this was before we hit record, but we were talking about one of the things that you're doing right now, which is this virtual C-suite program where you bring these sort of c-suite level, uh, professionals into other people's businesses and sort of help them [00:06:00] grow and help them change.

[00:06:01] You described yourself as the, like, not, not the smartest person in the room. Right. You're like, I'm the least smart person in the room. So, and 

[00:06:07] by, by far the least smart. It, it's, it's, it's, it's my metric. If somebody is not at least as smart as me, he's not fit for the virtual C-suite. Uh, I think one of the skills that lots of people lack, and to be honest, I, it, it's a skill I acquired.

[00:06:25] Very recently. So I'm not judging people who like that skill, but to really understand what they're good at and what they're not good at, and the list of stuff I'm not good at would fill the room. And there's two things I'm good at and there are very, very, very useful skills, but that's the only two I have.

[00:06:44] One is I'm a proper leader, so I know how to convince people to follow me. It's a very important skill, which doesn't make me a manager at all. I'm a, I suck at management, but I'm a leader. And second, and probably the most important skill in my job is the ability to cut through complexity. So I have the skill that you can give me a very complex problem and I'll turn it into five actionable steps.

[00:07:12] So that's my two skills. Apart from that, I'm really good at nothing. I was like, after I sold the company, I, I did the mental exercise. Say, okay, I'm, I, what do I do now? I'm 50. Was exactly 50 hours, 15 one month. What do I do? Do I do, I look for a job and like, there's literally no job I could apply for not one.

[00:07:32] I'm not smart. I'm, I'm not techy enough to be a CTO. God knows I cannot be a CEO because I'm absolutely miserable in operations. I definitely cannot be a CFO. There's literally nothing else I can do than being a CEO. So, yeah, so I got to school, to be honest, I didn't get to school very much to increase my knowledge mm-hmm.

[00:07:53] But more to start a network and to make friends and like that's how it started. But yeah, no, you, [00:08:00] ego, ego gets very often in the way. But again, I'm a little bit protected, uh, from that because again, the people with the massive ego don't tend to ask for help. They think they know everything. 

[00:08:13] There's a, a sele, a self-selection bias that happens with people seeking our help.

[00:08:18] Okay. So. There's like a million things I want to ask. And I know we're, we're gonna come up on time in a little bit, so I wanna be respectful of your time. 

[00:08:25] I, I, I have to ask, I have time. Dan, if you want to, if you want to keep recording, you 

[00:08:29] say that I will get, you said it was seven o'clock where you are.

[00:08:32] I'll keep you up past 10, but, okay. So cutting through complexity. So complexity is one of my favorite things. It's one of my favorite topics. It's to the point where like, I'm sure, I don't know if you have this relationship with your wife, there's like certain things that my wife does not want to talk about anymore.

[00:08:50] Like, she's done having this conversation. One of them is complexity, the other one is regression to the mean. I'm constantly bringing up, she hates that. So anyway, um, but I'm, I'm fascinated by complexity because I feel like things are always more complex than people make them out to be. But one of the challenges that I have is cutting through it in order to get to, okay, here's what you do about it, right?

[00:09:14] Because ultimately. It's only as valuable as what it shows you to do about it, right? Like I love, um, uh, Dave Snowden who does the Conne framework, right? And big co complex systems theorist, right? But it's, it ultimately, as fascinating as that is, it has to drive behavior in some way. You have to act in the, in the end, right?

[00:09:38] So when you are looking at, let's say, a problem business that is struggling on multiple levels, and I'll, I'll give you my example. I'll be honest about my example, right? I'm in an, I'm in two industries. I'm in a, an agent marketing agency and in, uh, my clients are all real estate investors, and we primarily do [00:10:00] Google ads.

[00:10:01] And so I see three simultaneous problems. One, the, in the, uh, economy's really rough on real estate investors now. They're probably their toughest economy for that business model since 2008, I think. Um, at the same time, I think agencies in general are gonna get their lunch eaten by ai. I don't know that for a fact, but I would probably wait that at like a 70% probability that there's gonna be a lot of downward price pressure on agencies over time.

[00:10:30] And then three, Google uh, is getting their lunch eaten by AI and less traffic's going to Google overall, less traffic's going to ads overall. So when I look at my business, we have these three things that are all struggling at the same time. And my question is, do I jump ship? Do I start something new? Do I try to improve what I'm doing?

[00:10:50] 'cause I could certainly improve it operationally. Do I just have to market it? There's like a million things I can do, but my challenge is how do I pick the one that's the real lever that matters. Right. So that's a specific, you don't have to address that specific problem. No, no, 

[00:11:06] I will because it's actually.

[00:11:09] You are in the middle of the storm that's hitting lots of companies right now. Mm-hmm. So basically your clients are dying, your business model is dying, and your and your channel for doing marketing is dying. Mm-hmm. All these are true. Yeah. It's a fact. Real estate, uh, real estate agents are dying. They're being replaced by ai.

[00:11:31] And no offense to your clients, but thank God 

[00:11:35] That's okay. That's a perfect way. Alright. 

[00:11:37] Uh, your, the human led marketing business is dying. Mm-hmm. Um, not only because of ai. AI is one, is one factor. Uh, the other factor is the mediocrity of your business in general. Mm-hmm. So contrary, that's a contrarian opinion by the way people think it's good to be good in a [00:12:00] market that's generally bad.

[00:12:01] I think it's bad that when a market is generally bad because like. If we didn't talk and you send me an email, uh uh, I'm a marketing agency. I want to work with you in my brain will be n plus one. Right. I, I got this email 67 times, uh, by yesterday. Mm-hmm. And, and I have no way to know that you are better than the other guys.

[00:12:26] Yeah. Uh, it's exactly the same with your client, by the way. I've been selling and buying real estate all around the world. I yet to ma to meet a real estate engine who's just honest. I'm not talking about being good or just trustworthy. I haven't met one yet. Doesn't mean they don't exist. I know they exist.

[00:12:45] I just haven't met them. You've never met it yet. Yeah. Yeah, because like most of them are not good. And then Google is dying. That's a fact. And you can see that they're in state of total panic, which is actually pretty fun to watch. I 

[00:13:00] can, I will. As someone who is largely dependent on Google for my income.

[00:13:04] Yes. I'll also agree that it is, it's been. Wild. I mean, it's just been wild to see. But yes, please continue. It 

[00:13:13] might be a little less fun for you to watch than it is for me. 

[00:13:17] Um, there's a certain bit of Schaden Freud that's happening. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 

[00:13:20] Definitely big schaden on that. Um, so

[00:13:28] addressing each of the three points. One, um, real estate agents are dying everywhere in the world. They're dying faster in the US so you can make tons of money on dying market. Like I would very strongly suggest to invest in oil refinery refineries now because everybody's telling nobody wants to invest because the market is dying.

[00:13:51] Yeah. In 30 years, by then you can be a billionaire. 

[00:13:54] Yeah. 

[00:13:54] Uh, so you have time on that particular front. And also there is real estate [00:14:00] agents all around the world and you have no reason to focus on the US right now. Okay. So that's, uh, so. Keep the real estate agent because that's what, you know, expand geographically because a real estate agent is a real estate agent wherever they are.

[00:14:17] Hmm. Google. Uh, okay, so marketing might, you know, has two legs, inbound and outbound people like you do only inbound. I don't really understand why. Uh, there is tons of other way to get a funnel than Google. So just explore them like your podcast, like, uh, LinkedIn, that's a bit more expensive than Google.

[00:14:41] LinkedIn is not dying anytime soon because their business is not too be a search engine. Um, so you have other way to do inbound marketing and you should think about outbound marketing, which nobody for some reason in your industry think of, but picking up your phone and calling people is a really good way of selling stuff.

[00:15:04] Not easy because you cannot do cold calling. You have to do warm calling and you have to pay people to do it. But like, just something to explore. The middle part is tricky. Like, yes, you, you, you are getting eaten alive by ai. My bet in your market, in, in many market AI is not gonna replace the agency. AI is gonna empower the agency.

[00:15:28] So instead of having 6,000 agencies, you're gonna have 600. And the 600 are gonna be the one who gonna know how to use a AI agents properly. 

[00:15:38] Yeah. 

[00:15:39] And you can see that in VC very, very clearly. They done investing in AI company, in AI agents company because there's now so many of them. And the, the, they're so expensive.

[00:15:50] Like you have to invest literally billions. So they done doing that and now they focus into investing in company that gets more efficient by using ai. [00:16:00] Mm-hmm. So that would be like top of my, of course, like it's just top of my head thing. Yeah. But like, you, you, you are not dead. But it's a good time for a pretty fundamental pivot, I'd say.

[00:16:11] Alright. I, well I love that and it's such, it's such a great illustration of kind of the way that you work through things systematically. Um, I wanna ask and I, I'll, I'll wrap things up 'cause I, uh, I, I'll try to be, try to be patient with the audience as well. But Yeah. I do wanna ask about, we've talked a lot about uncertainty and complexity.

[00:16:37] One of the things I wanted to ask about, I hope this isn't a personal question. It it was, you recently had a health issue and you posted about it on your LinkedIn and your Instagram, and one of my questions was about super rare events like black swan type events to use like the EB language, right?

[00:16:54] Because you know, we're talking about ai, we're talking about all these things. We talked about the three year plan and like pivoting and sort of implicit in a lot of these things is the thing that you don't know to plan for. And I'm, I'm wondering if that kind of health issue connects to that issue at, at all for you, how you think about these kind of very hard to plan for things if it's like, hey, you can't plan for them, so you just do your best and you see what you, you be, uh, you know, adaptable.

[00:17:25] How do you think about that kind of long tail uncertainty, either in your personal or your business life? And how that plays into the, the kind of complex systems thinking that you tend to do so well, 

[00:17:36] my heart attack, my, my wife gets so mad at me because of that. 'cause I keep saying it was a very minor heart, heart attack.

[00:17:46] Mm-hmm. And she said, no it was not. You had like four stents, you had major surgery. It was not minor. You almost died. They said, am I dead? It's minor then. Can, can't have been that major if I may. Yeah. Major heart attack will [00:18:00] kill you. Everything else. It's a minor heart attack. Right. Um, oh, she's gonna be so pissed when she hear that.

[00:18:06] We'll edit that out. That'll be 

[00:18:08] the explicit version would be fine. 

[00:18:10] Um, so two things about the black swans or the Black Dragons, like my Asian friends call them, which I think it's a much scarier image. Yeah, it's a cool, um, first of all, that the thing that keep us alive, that's the thing the AI by definition cannot plan for.

[00:18:26] Mm. So you will have to learn how to be agile. That's, uh, one of the biggest quality you see in a business is agility. 

[00:18:37] Yeah. 

[00:18:38] Um, second thing, they rare, but they're not that. Yeah. Like every time get a financial crisis. Oh God. How can that happen? Well, that happens every 10 years. So like, get over it. It happens.

[00:18:51] Like, so you, you cannot plan for when it'll happen. You can plan that, it'll happen. In my company. That's an anecdote, but in my company, they were all like super brilliant PhD level computer guys. So what they were all doing, it's far, it's instant Forex trading, it's, it's like you get leverage a million times with that leverage.

[00:19:17] You buy US dollars again, British pound, and you sell 10 times a day high frequency. Forex trading that will, they will make more money doing that than their salary. All of them lost the house and I was, I keep telling them, it said, this thing is gonna work until the next Black Swan event, and then while you trade on a 0.1 person margin because your leverage a hundred times, you're gonna get a 10% drop of the currency and you're gonna get the margin calls and you're gonna lose your house.

[00:19:49] And that's exactly what happened. I don't remember when it was like 2 20 14, 20 16. Yeah. The Swiss national banks stopped hedging the euro against the Swiss francs. And the [00:20:00] Swiss francs gained 20% to the Euros. Mm-hmm. And suddenly you're trading on 0.1% margin and you take 20% and that you can, you don't know when they're gonna happen, but you can plan knowing that they will happen.

[00:20:14] By the way, all that, I'm super wise now it's, it's, I did nothing of the above when I had my company and one of the. Initial, uh, demand I have to my client is I want a war chest. What, how many months of burn rate do you have in your war chest? And that's goal number one. I want nine months. If it takes nine months to make a baby, I want nine, nine months of, of dealing through a major crisis.

[00:20:43] And then it's adapted. Like when you have a lot of recurring revenue, you can have less. Or where you are in a company where you depend on one client, you need to have more stuff like that. But basically I want a watch chest because it's not like, oh, I don't anticipate shit happens. Shit will happen.

[00:21:00] Mm-hmm. Like it always does. 

[00:21:03] I think that's, uh, it's so interesting, right? Like a rem, I can't remember who, where I got this from, but I always think about the saying of. The specifics are totally unpredictable, but the fact that something unpredictable will happen is completely predictable. It's a certainty.

[00:21:20] Yeah, absolutely. Okay. I have to ask, I'm gonna end with this question. I don't usually ask this question, but I'm, I'm very interested because you have, you have such a unique style, you have such a unique way of thinking. Um, I'm really curious if there was, uh, a book or even a particular person who really influenced the way that you see the world.

[00:21:45] Um, like if you, if you were gonna recommend a book or even like a person to go look up, is there someone that you would point to and say, that was someone who had a big impact on the way that I sort of see and move through the world? 

[00:21:58] No, like I, I [00:22:00] am, um, that's a big weakness of mine. I'm with a co-founder in my business that read like a hundred books per month, and I read science, I read science fiction novel, so the ISAC Chasm of, but it's not really a business.

[00:22:14] Uh, hey, I will take an Asimov recommendation. I think that's amazing. That's, that's like, I don't read business books and, uh, I, I wrote a business book, but I don't read them, and that's so long on my part. I just get so bored. I mean, it's, I find them so boring. This 

[00:22:30] is good. Well, look, I, I actually think the science fiction novel thing makes a lot of sense because mm-hmm.

[00:22:36] Science fiction deals with complexity. It deals with hard to, you know, sort of wrap your mind around situations. Do you have a go-to science fiction novel recommendation? So. I've read some science fiction, the most recent one that I, I read the three body problem and really loved it, but I don't know the genre particularly well.

[00:22:54] Is there a, so 

[00:22:55] that's, you were making, that's the best scientific science fiction book ever written. I'm rereading it for the third time. It's so complex. Like, it's so complicated and especially the third volume. Like we, so I haven't 

[00:23:10] read, I've only read the first one. Ah, I've never read the, I picked the other two.

[00:23:14] Yeah. Especially the third one where I still believe you need a, a PhD in mathematics to, by the way, my best friend who has started the company with and recommended that book to me has a PhD in theoretical physics. So from time to time I call him for, for him to explain a concept to me. And he said, but it's so simple.

[00:23:33] Yeah, it is. When you have a PhD in theoretical physics. No, I'm, I'm anazi of fan. Definitely. I reread the whole of from, from time to time. And this one is, is like, read read. I'm so jealous that you haven't read the volume two and three, like the dark, dark forest. The, the, the second volume is really great.

[00:23:57] The third one, I'm like, I'm [00:24:00] hanging in there. It's the third time I'm reading it and I'm hanging in there. It's so hard. And also what make it super hard, uh, is all the name are in Chinese, right? So I spend my whole time saying, have we seen that character or is it pretty new? Oh, that's the cop. Okay. That's the cop, right?

[00:24:18] Yeah, 

[00:24:19] that's the, yeah. Let me just name him Gary or something before I could. Yeah. Uh, that's alright. Well that's a great recommendation 'cause those, those were, those have been on my list, but it's, it was a while since I read the first one and I've, I just kind of lost track of it. So I'm gonna go back. I will absolutely, I'll reread the first one.

[00:24:35] And then I'll read the next 

[00:24:36] one. Yeah, you have to because if you don't read the second one, like if it's more than 15 minutes between the first and the second one, you'll get lost. So, okay. Uh, by the way, just for the record, I'm not recommending not reading business book. It's a shortcomings of mine. Don't imitate me.

[00:24:51] Read all the, well, we, well we have a recommendation 

[00:24:54] that we can give, which of course is the book Cashing Out, which is by Alexis Sikorsky. Can you tell people a little bit about the book? We'll, we'll end on this. Uh, I know the book tells a little bit about your story. It tells a little bit about selling a business, but like.

[00:25:09] What's the pitch for the book if people are curious about learning more about how you think? 

[00:25:13] Yeah. This one, I, this one I actually read. Um, so basically the, the mental path to get to that is say, okay, now that I'm doing my advisor business, I can help 10 companies per year, but what about all the other ones?

[00:25:30] Mm. 

[00:25:30] And I say, okay, lots of people will never be able to pay for my services. And even if I was giving them for free, I won't touch that many people. And that sounds super new agey bullshit, but I really enjoy helping people. It's really what makes me happy in life. So I wrote the book that's basically about a simple methodology to get from small to less small, and a [00:26:00] simple methodology on how to speak private equity, like basics from that.

[00:26:07] I love that. Well, and we know right from your personal story, right, having that knowledge earlier in your process, like you said, you could have sold five years earlier and for 50 million more or whatever it was. Uh, I think that sounds like an incredible value. So just so for people that can go check this out, it's at Amazon.

[00:26:26] I know they can find it on Amazon. Maybe they can find it in other places as well. It's called Caching Out by Alexis Sikorsky. That's spelled S-I-K-O-R-S-K-Y. And go check that out. We also mentioned the virtual C-Suite. I mean, I didn't even touch on, you run like a, a kind of mastermind group. You have so many different things going on.

[00:26:45] Uh, but people can go find your business at. Um, it's at night. I don't wanna mess it up. It's Night Partners. What Website, night Skin 

[00:26:54] Partners. Night scale partners. 

[00:26:56] Night scale partners, which is with the K 'cause we talked about that beginning night scale partners.com, and I highly recommend it. People don't follow you on LinkedIn.

[00:27:05] They can go find you on LinkedIn as well. I think your LinkedIn posts are great. Um, you post the same stuff on Instagram as well, so they can go find you on social media. Any, anything else that you want to throw people to, to go check out or anything? No, 

[00:27:18] I, I'm lucky enough to have, uh, uh, uncommon names, so I'm easy to find.

[00:27:23] There you go. I love it. So I'm not John Smith, so I'm easy to find. Yeah. So if you want to find me, you'll find me. I'm not, you don't have to be like the real Alex. The Alexis. Yeah, the real Alexis Koki. I don't need that. 

[00:27:34] All right. So I highly recommend if you don't follow Alexis already, go find him on LinkedIn.

[00:27:38] Go find him on Instagram. Go check out the book. Which is cashing out. You can find it on Amazon or go to knight scale partners.com to learn more about Alexis and everything he does. Alexis Sikorsky, thank you so much. This, this conversation was so valuable to me. I don't care about the audience. I only care about myself.

[00:27:56] Yeah. 

[00:27:56] We never care about the audience. No, 

[00:27:58] I, I, uh, I can't [00:28:00] tell you how much I appreciate your time and, uh, all your wisdom, so thank you so much for, for being here. I really appreciate it. 

[00:28:05] Thank you, Dan. It was my pleasure.